In the early-to-mid-’00s, AC programmers—who were being sent little usable product from Mainstream Top 40—relied heavily on Country crossovers. Country and Mainstream AC stations were reliable sharers and a strong Country station was often thought of as a de facto AC or Hot AC for its market. So now that AC has more viable pop music coming from CHR, how important is Country crossover? And how closely linked are the two formats?

With Country Radio Seminar beginning this week, Radio-Info talked to both AC and Country PDs (and some who work with both formats) and got a dramatic range of responses. Some AC PDs see Country crossover as having cooled—although that largely comes as news to their Country counterparts. For their part, Country PDs now tend to regard pop success of their artists as a positive—a change from the more mixed emotions of a decade ago.

Viewed from a long-term perspective, the formats have certainly moved into each other’s orbits. “As Country radio has evolved from the ‘outlaw’ male-oriented approach to one that favors adult females, it's perfectly natural that the two formats would share listeners,” says 13 Management’s Frank Bell. “I think we're still in each other’s sights, we're both targeting a [listener in her] 30s to 40s,” says Buzz Jackson, PD of Country KIIM Tucson, Ariz.

But Mark Edwards, the newly arrived PD of AC KUDL Kansas City, says, “The number of [Country] songs that make the grade at AC is certainly down from where it was five or six years ago, partly because AC doesn’t have to go to the Country world to find music, but also because there are more pure country acts that just wouldn’t sound right on an AC now.”

A rival Country PD has a similar take. “I’m seeing much less interaction with our AC stations in town,” says Mike Kennedy, PD of KBEQ (Q104). “As you can imagine we share substantially with [Country] KFKF and WDAF. However, in our top five [sharers], there is the active rock station, classic rock station and our own CHR station [KMXV].

“I honestly don’t even think about what the AC is doing musically,” Kennedy continues. “Today it’s our CHR station that gets to Taylor and Lady Antebellum before AC does… Since PPM has taken over, it’s really shown, contrary to our [previous beliefs], that the AC stations are way down on our ranker of shared listening.” (For their part, several AC PDs made comments about regarding Swift as a CHR, not Country, artist.)

“An occasional Country to AC crossover is good for AC, but I don’t sense AC PDs combing Country for records they can co-opt,” says consultant Alan Burns. “I think Lady Antebellum was an exceptional song and Taylor Swift crossed because of the Top 40 airplay.” As for markets where “a big Country also serves as a semi-AC, the better the AC is, the less Country fills that need.” He cites one market where a resurgent AC has fewer Country titles at the top of its music research as time goes on.

“There are certainly not as many Country crossovers to AC these days as there used to be. However, those country artists from a few years ago (LeAnn Rimes, Shania Twain, Faith Hill, etc.) still test extremely strong with the mainstream AC format and continue to get a lot of spins,” says Jerry Dean, OM of Entercom/Memphis, including AC WRVR.

“Things seem to have cooled down a bit over the past few years,” says Barry Fox, PD of AC WRAL (Mix 101.5) Raleigh, N.C. “But all it takes is a couple of superstars to release a new album and the floodgates reopen. I think the Taylor Swift tune is a smash. If the Kenny [Chesney], Tim [McGraw] and Sugarland songs all make it over the hump, it’s going to get crowded. Country crossover titles usually test very well and are still an important part of our on-air mix.”

Not every AC PD sees Country as less of an issue. “I happen to think that Country is hot again and a lot of the songs sound good on AC,” says AC KOSI Denver PD Gary Nolan. “The thing to watch is that we don’t play too many of them.” “There is a lot of great pop appeal Country lately, and that’s cool with us,” says Bobby Rich, PD of KIIM’s AC rival KMXZ (94.9 Mix FM).

In Knoxville, Tenn., there’s no question for AC WJXB (B97.5) PD Jeff Jarnigan that Country behemoth WIVK is “the closest thing to another AC in the market… every station in the market shares about 30% with them.” WYXB, along with WJKK (Mix 98.7) Jackson, Miss., is more aggressive on Country crossovers than many other ACs; the two are among the surprisingly few AC stations to acknowledge The Band Perry’s “If I Die Young” thus far.

“It’s a conscious decision to go out to the edge on the things we can play,” Jarnigan says. “But we’re also pretty fortunate. Taylor Swift crosses so many boundaries that it’s not a big stretch for us. The Tim McGraw and Kenny Chesney records don’t sound like traditional Country songs, and Kenny is from here.”

Kevin Callahan, PD of Country KSON San Diego, was previously PD of WYJB (B95) Albany, N.Y. —a station that so considered Country WGNA to be its main competitor that it launched Country flanker WZMR against them. “In many ways, I think there is more potential Country crossover today than in some years. Beyond Taylor, Carrie Underwood, and Lady Antebellum, Sugarland, Thompson Square and some others have crossover potential as well in my opinion,” he says.

And if AC is in any way less interested in Country product, it’s news to Country PDs, and those who work with both formats. “There is a ton of crossover, in both directions,” says Clear Channel/Western Mass., OM Don Gosselin, who oversees both Country WPKX (Kix 97.9) and Hot AC WHYN (Mix 93.1). “Hot AC artists like Kelly Clarkson, Kid Rock, Uncle Kracker, Jewel, even Aaron Lewis, are working to build a Country audience.”

“Seems like we're borrowing each other's music more and more,” says Country consultant Joel Raab. “Some of AC's best artists are Country. Country to a lesser extent has borrowed from pop (Kid Rock, Kelly Clarkson) but looking into my crystal ball, I think it will happen more and more. If AC can borrow from Country, why not in reverse, within reason, of course? I think some Country stations could have played the John Mayer/Taylor Swift duet. Jason Aldean will soon be heard on Pop radio. Stay tuned.” [Sirius XM’s Hits 1, has already given Aldean’s Kelly Clarkson duet, “Don’t You Wanna Stay,” considerable airplay.]

KIIM’s Jackson notes that, “In my particular situation, three of [KMXZ’s] top ten songs this week are songs that we have also played in current rotation, and two of those were country singles first [Lady Antebellum and Taylor Swift]; the third is the Uncle Kracker ‘Smile,’” a reverse crossover from AC to Country.

Whatever cross-format traffic does exist today speaks to nearly 15 years of trial and error in managing potential artist custody battles between Country and pop since crossovers became a regular fact of life again in the late ’90s. Compared to a decade ago, there’s less Country PD grumbling about the songs that do go to AC—often because labels are careful to give Country a lengthy window of exclusivity with them. (It was only after the successful deployment of that strategy that artists like McGraw, Chesney or Brad Paisley started to work records to AC.)

As KSON’s Callahan notes, “I’m happy to see more Country going to the mainstream, because I believe it to be a two way street. The more the mainstream finds Country accessible the more listening for the format.” That’s a sentiment voiced by several PDs here, but that fewer Country PDs were willing to buy into a decade ago.

The care that labels take to maintain the Country base hasn’t gone unnoticed on the AC side. “What concerns me is [when] Country artists that do crossover are still hesitant to embrace AC stations,” says Dean. “Carrie Underwood recently came to town for a concert. I wouldn’t be surprised if WRVR actually gave Carrie more spins than [Country WGKX]. But her management would have nothing to do with us.”

Similarly, Dean says, “Lady Antebellum was quick to thank ‘country radio’ at the Grammys, but where was the love for AC radio, who played a big part in making ‘Need You Now’ the huge hit it was. Would Lady Antebellum have gotten the worldwide exposure they did without the support of AC radio?”